Why I and many others will rarely play open

keep reading into it what you want. Elitism is wanting everyone flying around the same game so i can interact with them. Get away with you. What a joke.
Well, you essentially want to shove everybody into your happy Open game to improve your game, regardless of whether that would improve their games, right?

Wouldn’t you rather play with people who actually want to play with you? That’s why I choose Open when I’m in an excitable and sociable mode, and stick to playing with myself when I’m not... that’s the choice we’ve all been given at the menu screen, from long before I was here.
 
It's obvious that if you split the games players up that a social online multiplayer game isnt going to be as good. It's completely obvious. However many you do see, you would see many more if the player base wasnt split. And as i said in my post, i have only ever been ganked and i've done no pvp. Just because i dont gank, it doesnt mean i can't see that the better game is going to be one with more players around. Even if the cost of those more players was getting ganked more myself, it would still be worth it.

Open is the proper game. It's the real game. And im arguing for a better open mode rather than a gank fest. People should be able to play in open mode. There needs to be changes so that everyone can use open. The best experiences ive ever had in social multiplayer games has been where ive been in the middle of something else and ive come into contact with someone. You lose that in solo. Every social interaction is so calculated when you play in solo.

I don't want social interactions in Elite - if I want to be social, I'll come here or use Twitter; I play Elite to relax after a long day of dealing with human beings.
 
It's obvious that if you split the games players up that a social online multiplayer game isnt going to be as good. It's completely obvious. However many you do see, you would see many more if the player base wasnt split. And as i said in my post, i have only ever been ganked and i've done no pvp. Just because i dont gank, it doesnt mean i can't see that the better game is going to be one with more players around. Even if the cost of those more players was getting ganked more myself, it would still be worth it.

Open is the proper game. It's the real game. And im arguing for a better open mode rather than a gank fest. People should be able to play in open mode. There needs to be changes so that everyone can use open. The best experiences ive ever had in social multiplayer games has been where ive been in the middle of something else and ive come into contact with someone. You lose that in solo. Every social interaction is so calculated when you play in solo.

Yikes. what a complete lack of understanding of gaming community coupled if self entitled elitism.


Just the notion that any game mode should be better or more "proper" than any other game mode tells everything about motives and total lack of understanding of the players.

If you would spend some time to actually reading up on how online games have changed and that gameplay that YOU prefer, is actually a minority of the total player base, as the shift in design of MMO games have shifted from a social platform where the game was the social platform to login and interact with other players, because back in the days when this was the norm, we did not have all the social platforms available today. As we got more social platforms available outside of these games, people started to use those instead. Now I would say one of the biggest such platform is Discord, where people join and hang out with their "friends", share tales and stories, etc, and there is no need for them all to be in the same game to do this!
And since playing games is about your own enjoyment, then most players do NOT want their precious game time ruined by other players, so they rightfully demands more solo content over force multiplayer content, and since thye are the larger player base, of course games are going to cater to their wished more over those players that wants "forced" player interaction. This is simple math.

If you design a game, that will alienate over 50% of your potential playerbase, then that is your call to make, but if you require investment capital to produce your game, you will now have to convince those investors why it is a good business, no game, decision to do so.


So how large is this player interaction group? I have seen figures that circulates around 25-30% and figures around 60-70% for players to prefer solo play. so now we are not talking about 50% reduction of potential players, we are talking about 75% reduction, so if you cannot milk those social seeking players for 75% more money, then this is a bad business proposition to sell to an investor...


So trying to sell in, Open as the "proper" game mode is quite telling here... as you are trying to FORCE your way of playing onto players who simply do not care or want your preferred game style. What would your response be if we proclaimed that we should remove Open PERMANENTLY? This would be something you would not like, as that would remove your preferred game mode in favour of those game modes preferred by others. so do not get hung up on my use of permanently, that is just to exaggerate this, as the effect is the same when proclaim that Open is the only proper game mode and everyone should play in open..


So as long you going to proclaim that Open is the only proper game that everyone should use, then I tell you that you should NEVER be allowed to play in open.
 
If one doesn't just want to pose as prey, one has to commit to grindy "end game" way of playing the game, where just the last meta-ships are acceptable options. This is basically why one gets intercepted by these type of ships - those have commited to end game and see it as the only way to stay competitive. It means further some serious amount of time commitment as well, so it is not likely that a family guy can play like this or anyone with a significant investment in his real life profession. This again means, that mainly those play "end game" content, who have the time of doing so - and are mostly younger with quite an amount of aggressive behavior as well (spending the time on playing a game like this is not helping them find a real life partner, which would lead to a more balanced attitude in life) - so in the end these people are more aggressive with an attitude. And this is why people not playing like this see them as "griefers" - because they are exactly that to a person with a more balanced life and less of an attitude or desire to mess with others.

My reason to mostly not play in open is, that I don't want to meet the end-game player type, because they have an attitude not compatible with mine - simple as that. But then there is my desire to be as well able to play in OPEN - but this would mean, i would have to accept to be basically prey once in a while - so it rarely happens that I play in OPEN. I haven't been intercepted by a player yet and maybe I could escape the situation - but at best it would add nothing to the enjoyment of the game and in the worst case, it would just make me avoid OPEN again. I have no desire to shoot other players or destroy their ships - and even less to be shot at or getting my ship destroyed - so why play OPEN?

I can counter that with the saying "opposites attract". Irl if you want a long-term, stable relationship, dating someone just like you is often a mistake. People like to be challenged by their significant others, and to be called out on their <EDIT: Redacted>. Compatibility can get awfully boring.

And that's why sex robots will fail, imo.
 
To me playing this game is a recreational activity. In the same way that swimming is. If I want to go swimming and I find the pool full of man-eating sharks, I'm afraid to get in. That is actual fear coming into the equation. Sure, I could use a shark cage "to git gud" in the shark tank but merely surviving one shark attack after another doesn't satisfy my need for recreation.

Similarly, if I arrive at the pool and find it full of sewage, I'm still not keen to get in. Granted it is not as (immediately) life threatening as swimming with the sharks. Also, the "adjustments to my swimming style" necessary to use the pool (e.g. wearing a diving suit and apparatus) might remove the lesser danger but again I wouldn't be keen. My reluctance wouldn't be so much based on fear as a sense of wasting valuable time having to take such precautions, perhaps with some revulsion mixed in. And that isn't conducive to (my) recreation either.

I think the Look-at-me-what-a-lad-that's-why-it's-called-dangerous-carebeary-forumdads-hiding-in-solo-need-to-git-gud-I'm-a-well'ard-edgelords regard Open as resembling the shark pool and hence conclude the avoidance of it as driven by a sense of fear (whatever that might mean in a game). My view of Open is more like the the septic tank; plain fact of the matter is, I'm not keen on having to spend my already limited recreational time avoiding the turds that occasionally bob up.
 
It's easy to switch to solo and hide, it's your choice completely of course, but by adding extra challenge and risk, the game becomes much more enjoyable and immersive, even if you're a total noob at PvP.

I agree that the extra challenge can be exciting. And sometimes I choose this mode of play.

But remember the risk is significantly greater for the cmdr that isn't flying the PvP ship.
  • Not as powerful as a dedicated combat ship.
  • Gonna be caught unexpectedly, on terms of the aggressor.
  • Possibly not in full repair (returning from PvE activities)
  • Possibly lose their mission, exploration data, cargo, or passengers.
  • Possibly have to pay a rebuy. For some cmdrs expensive.
  • At best will be able to "run away" (assuming the PvP cmdr isn't awful)

Whats the upside for a typical player engaged in non-combat activities?

Easy to say, make a PvP ready ship for your non-combat activities. Obviously a dedicated PvP ship will have significant advantage. So really just make a defensive PvP ship capable of surviving & running away.
 
We all get our kicks in different ways but a zero risk game to me seems like zero fun.

PvP in open is completely without proportional risk and it's lame. My account has infinite everything and I'd love me some PvP, if it weren't so terribly organised. Open without a good warrant system has 0 appeal to me because it has 0 risk to the experienced player.

These people moaning that newbie/PvE Solo players are somehow cowardly, or unadjusted to the harshness and dangerousness of space (f-ing lol) – even though they endorse a PvP system that lets them grief without in-game consequences, or more mildly, allows them be mass murderers in this "dangerous space" then act like it's normal/canon that stations will still allow them to dock and do repairs – are absolutely crazy town banana pants ridiculous.

EDIT: to clarify again, I'd play in Open fulltime for both PvE and PvP if there were decent PK rules.
 
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Easy to say, make a PvP ready ship for your non-combat activities. Obviously a dedicated PvP ship will have significant advantage. So really just make a defensive PvP ship capable of surviving & running away.
Exactly. It's all part of the game. Your ship doesn't have to be PvP capable to be able to defend against/run away from attackers. The only time I can imagine when players might fail to escape and get blown up is if they're total noobs who weren't familiar with basic game mechanics or simply panicked.
 
This may surprise some of you, but gankers are cool people to play with also.
From my personal experience, "the law & order" guys are more "not cool" than gankers.
Gankers/pvpers are doing what they preach and i respect that.
As for Spear guys and such "lawful" cmdrs, don't have positive experience with them.
So not all gankers are bad and not all "police" cmdrs are good.

I don't know man. I still cry myself to sleep everytime I flashback to that time you tried to gank my alt in Colonia. There I was, minding my own business in a wee baby Phantom, armed with nothing but PAs and Rails, bam! Holo Square, interdiction game... which you failed! To add injury to insult, after failing at step one, you wouldn't even consent to being baited into a bit of system banter. Disappointing experience all round.
 
I think the Look-at-me-what-a-lad-that's-why-it's-called-dangerous-carebeary-forumdads-hiding-in-solo-need-to-git-gud-I'm-a-well'ard-edgelords

Wanna try something cool? Try proposing serious in-game consequences through decent PK rules to these people. The resulting carebear stare is visible from orbit.

Almost like there was a bit of projection going on in the first place, hm?
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
The shame is that i think everyone should be in open. The game is ruined through splitting the player base up.
Not everyone shares that opinion - and the game makes other players, and therefore PvP, an entirely optional extra, by design.
I think the balance is off for this to be an issue.
It's the way the game was pitched, over eight years ago: three game modes sharing a single galaxy state - where every player experiences and affects the galaxy. Players being given a per-session choice as to which game mode to play in was no accident.
Griefers are just twitch gamers that want to fight people and the game makes it hard to do that. They are actually forced to attack just random people because its the only action they are likely to get.
They're not "forced" to do anything - they choose to do what they do. That they choose to play in a way that other players may wish to avoid is their choice - and other players don't need to choose to play among them. Then there's the block feature - rather than leave Open the player can block particular player(s) and is unlikely to be instanced with them again.
Also, maybe notorious should make you more visible within the game somehow. Like making you appear on the galaxy map maybe. Maybe there could be another filter, the same as the one that shows you where fleet carriers are at, that shows you where notorious commanders are.
Using notoriety as a filter could be interesting - as it could be used to affect the matchmaking server - so that players with the "report crimes against me" flag set would be less likely to instance with notorious players in Open.
Another interesting one i thought of, maybe we should get the ability to give a distress call when attacked. Like a pvp distress call that pops up in the system, maybe even up to a couple of systems away. So if pvp lasts too long, you've got the chance of people dropping in to help. Hell, it might even change griever behaviour to make them target each other more.
A distress call would be just as likely to invite more of attackers to drop in to the instance as it would be to attract those who might defend the player who made the distress call - or the distress call could be a fake.
I honestly think this game shouldn't allow a solo, and ive not even done any pvp myself, apart from the initial ganking you get when you first start out and dont know where to avoid. It ruins the atmosphere of the game. Changes need to be made within the game so that we can deal with the problems ourselves without mod oversight. Make the griever's more visible, give non griefers the chance to get meaningful help. Give the pvp types somewhere to spend energy.
That presumes that players who eschew PvP want to be bothered by those who wish to engage other players in PvP. For some, PvP is a tedious and predictable waste of limited game time. Thankfully Frontier foresaw the fact that not all players would want to play in a PvP-enabled multi-player game mode so offered Solo and Private Groups alongside Open when they pitched their game design.
 
"Why I and many others will rarely play open"

My most important reason is that I do not care for the company.
I do not need other humans in my game world.
It is bad enough that I encounter the MMO traces everywhere in my private game.
I do not need to know that Whim@pie@1924 discovered some star system first.
I also do not need to see 20 fleet carriers in one system.
I'd pay extra for the removal of this nonsense from my game.
 
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Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
Exactly. It's all part of the game. Your ship doesn't have to be PvP capable to be able to defend against/run away from attackers. The only time I can imagine when players might fail to escape and get blown up is if they're total noobs who weren't familiar with basic game mechanics or simply panicked.
Why should the target compromise their ship, affecting their gameplay, to accommodate those who preferentially attack players?

Much better to select whichever game mode best suits ones expectations for the game session, in my experience.
 
Wanna try something cool? Try proposing serious in-game consequences through decent PK rules to these people. The resulting carebear stare is visible from orbit.

Almost like there was a bit of projection going on in the first place, hm?

I know exactly what you mean ...

PvP in open is completely without proportional risk and it's lame. My account has infinite everything and I'd love me some PvP, if it weren't so terribly organised. Open without a good warrant system has 0 appeal to me because it has 0 risk to the experienced player.

EDIT: to clarify again, I'd play in Open fulltime for both PvE and PvP if there were decent PK rules.

This is it in a nutshell for me too. The PvP environment in this game is total cobblers. I get my PvP playing other games that have some semblance of risk/reward balance to the activity. But not here.
 
Exactly. It's all part of the game. Your ship doesn't have to be PvP capable to be able to defend against/run away from attackers. The only time I can imagine when players might fail to escape and get blown up is if they're total noobs who weren't familiar with basic game mechanics or simply panicked.
Except, whats the upside? Why does a typical player want to design their ship so that at best they can run away?

Okay, I got my Imperial Cutters with big huge shields and fast thrusters. My Mini Fleet With cargo I'm not going to risk fighting back. I can run away. Whoopee. This isn't PvP. This is me running away.
 
Except, whats the upside? Why does a typical player want to design their ship so that at best they can run away?

Okay, I got my Imperial Cutters with big huge shields and fast thrusters. My Mini Fleet With cargo I'm not going to risk fighting back. I can run away. Whoopee. This isn't PvP. This is me running away.

None of my ships have shields as Lord Braben is the best shield generator and Open is filled with carebears.
 
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