Release Trade Dangerous (Est. 2015) Power user's highly configurable trade optimizer

Hello together,

Yes, the point "." and comma "," problem is solved. Thanks Mark for the fast correction !

Unfortunately I have another problem :eek:. I wanted to update the goods market at stations. This was not possible because some goods were recognized as ERROR.
These are the following goods ANTIQUE JEWELLERY, GENE BANK, TIME CAPSULE, WRECKAGE COMPONENTS and ANCIENT KEY.
The file Item.csv does not contain these goods. I have updated TDH. But it didn't help.

Thanks for your help (again) :)

Greetings Mathias
 
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ANTIQUE JEWELLERY, GENE BANK, and TIME CAPSULE are salvage items that have not been added to EDDB's API, which TD uses as its source for building the item list. I've updated TD to manually add those items with a temporary ID until such point as EDDB gets around to updating. Update to the latest version of TD if you haven't already and run "trade.py import -P eddblink -O item,force" to fix them.


WRECKAGE COMPONENTS I was not aware of, although if memory serves they are included by a different name. I'm not at home right now to check, I'll look into it when I have time later. If not, it'll be added the same way the other three are in the next update.

(EDIT: Yes, "WRECKAGE COMPONENTS" is listed as "SALVAGEABLE WRECKAGE" because that's what EDDB.io lists that item as.)

ANCIENT KEY is a rare item, it has to be added manually by editing the RareItem.csv file. I'll do that with the next update as well.

(EDIT2: Nevermind, looks like I was wrong, ANCIENT KEY is also a salvage item. Working on it now.)

I should be able to get this done later today or tomorrow at the latest.
 
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Anyone know how to get the fdev_id, AKA EDID, for an item? Doesn't look like any of the various programs that have that have updated to include the Ancient Key yet.
 
TD has been updated to include the Ancient Key. Update your local copy of TD and run "trade.py import -P eddblink -O item,force" to get the database updated.
 
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TD (and the listener) have been updated to include the Ancient Key and to use "Wreckage Components" instead of "Salvageable Wreckage" for that item. Turns out "Salvageable Wreckage" is the name of the type of signal where "Wreckage Components" can be found, so EDDB did a goof.

Make sure when updating TD to do an item run, as described in my last.
 
TD (and the listener) have been updated to include the Ancient Key and to use "Wreckage Components" instead of "Salvageable Wreckage" for that item. Turns out "Salvageable Wreckage" is the name of the type of signal where "Wreckage Components" can be found, so EDDB did a goof.

Make sure when updating TD to do an item run, as described in my last.
Hello eyeonus,

Short explanation of how I came up with the missing goods.
I use EDMC https://github.com/Marginal/EDMarketConnector/wiki . EDMC generates a station-datum.price-file for TD from the journal (or API or logs).
This station-datum.price-file contained the goods in question. But not in item.csv.
But everything's OK now.

Thank you very much :)

Greetings Mathias
 
I use EDMC https://github.com/Marginal/EDMarketConnector/wiki . EDMC generates a station-datum.price-file for TD from the journal (or API or logs).
This station-datum.price-file contained the goods in question. But not in item.csv.
Glad to see you using EDMC for this purpose. Not many people use that functionality (of EDMC or TD) so it's nice to have confirmation it's useful.

EDMC is our suggested tool for creating local .prices files (per wiki) and the only one we would support, as it's also well supported by our friends on the EDMC team.
 
I've just tried to get the market data for a particular station and although it gives the commodities, the price information is missing. The command I'm running is:

trade.py market --sell -vv "Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital" or market -vv "Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital"

Neither of these show the sell prices. Am I missing something?

Thanks.
 
I would love to test that for you Mark and check... however until..


Eyeonus, can you put in a quick/dirty fix for Alliance Crusader (presently not present in index.json) until they add it?


...after which I shall attempt to replicate Mark's prpblem :)

Meantime, I recommend that everyone run import with skipvend and absolutely don't run with clean, or shipvend (like I just did).
 
I've just tried to get the market data for a particular station and although it gives the commodities, the price information is missing. The command I'm running is:

trade.py market --sell -vv "Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital" or market -vv "Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital"

Neither of these show the sell prices. Am I missing something?

Thanks.
Hello Mark,

I use the order "market" , and this is the output:

Code:
Command line: -u "C:\trade\trade.py" market --b -vvv "Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital"
    Item                      Buying     Avg     Demand Age/Days
----------------------------------------------------------------
+CHEMICALS
    Explosives                                                  
    Hydrogen Fuel                                               
    Hydrogen Peroxide            659   1.105     8.441H     0.41
    Liquid Oxygen                598     438         0?     0.41
    Mineral Oil                  418     472    28.960H     0.41
    Surface Stabilisers                                         
    Water                        601     397       904H     0.41
+CONSUMER ITEMS
    Clothing                     371     539     2.707H     0.41
    Consumer Technology        6.876   7.346       367H     0.41
    Domestic Appliances          813     781       926H     0.41
+FOODS
    Animal Meat                1.689   1.775    69.014M     5.49
    Coffee                     1.843   1.729    21.433M     5.49
    Fish                         891     815   246.541M     5.49
    Food Cartridges              614     337    16.571H     5.49
    Fruit and Vegetables         783     682    77.868M     5.49
    Grain                        646     569   505.549M     5.49
    Synthetic Meat               725     602    52.130H     5.49
    Tea                        2.051   1.936    79.972M     5.49
+INDUSTRIAL MATERIALS
    Insulating Membrane                                         
    Polymers                                                    
    Semiconductors                                              
    Superconductors                                             
+LEGAL DRUGS
    Beer                         346     556     3.952H     0.41
    Bootleg Liquor               697     598     6.012H     0.41
    Liquor                     1.288     993    30.744H     0.41
    Tobacco                    5.326   5.446       317H     0.41
    Wine                         664     536     2.658H     0.41
+MACHINERY
    Microbial Furnaces           588     584     9.158H     0.41
    Power Generators             889     757     3.132H     0.41
    Water Purifiers            1.833     503   126.150H     0.41
+MEDICINES
    Advanced Medicines         3.226   1.845 9.458.406H     0.41
    Basic Medicines            4.598     838 3.322.567H     0.41
    Performance Enhancers      6.876   7.407       132H     0.41
    Progenitor Cells           6.876   7.301       184H     0.41
+METALS
    Aluminium                                                   
    Beryllium                                                   
    Cobalt                                                      
    Copper                                                      
    Gallium                                                     
    Gold                                                        
    Indium                                                      
    Lithium                                                     
    Palladium                                                   
    Silver                                                      
    Tantalum                                                    
    Titanium                                                    
    Uranium                                                     
+MINERALS
    Bauxite                      469     276    43.422H     0.41
    Bertrandite                2.577   2.611    17.289H     0.41
    Coltan                     1.333   1.566    27.397H     0.41
    Cryolite                   2.233   2.771    19.097H     0.41
    Gallite                    1.935   2.036    21.210H     0.41
    Goslarite                    616   1.335    20.676H     0.41
    Indite                     2.233   2.344    19.165H     0.41
    Lepidolite                   659     768    28.060H     0.41
    Lithium Hydroxide          5.044   5.572     1.551H     0.41
    Low Temperature Diamonds  97.629  96.080        30H     0.41
    Methane Clathrate            595     833    13.422H     0.41
    Painite                   33.320  70.913       373H     0.41
    Pyrophyllite               1.441   2.029    17.727H     0.41
    Rutile                       508     466    14.767H     0.41
    Uraninite                    686   1.056    19.654H     0.41
+SALVAGE
    Ancient Casket             8.043   7.961     3.315H     0.41
    Ancient Key               13.240  13.160     3.315H     0.57
    Ancient Orb                9.094   9.010     3.315H     0.41
    Ancient Relic             13.240  13.141     3.315H     0.41
    Ancient Tablet             9.094   9.009     3.315H     0.41
    Ancient Totem             10.962  10.871     3.315H     0.41
    Ancient Urn                6.313   6.237     3.315H     0.41
    Antique Jewellery         31.964 143.673     1.864H     0.41
    Assault Plans                628     961     1.864H     0.41
    Black Box                 17.145  18.676       373H     0.41
    Commercial Samples           586     586     1.864H     0.41
    Damaged Escape Pod         6.463  12.676       373H     0.41
    Data Core                  3.151   3.126     5.594H     0.41
    Diplomatic Bag               875   1.010     1.864H     0.41
    Earth Relics               5.837  11.806     1.864H     0.41
    Encrypted Correspondence     610     921     1.864H     0.41
    Encrypted Data Storage     1.191   1.535     1.864H     0.41
    Fossil Remnants           10.634   9.283    27.971H     0.41
    Gene Bank                  6.620  11.182     1.864H     0.41
    Geological Samples           628     758     1.864H     0.41
    Hostage                   24.981  37.219       373H     0.41
    Large Survey Data Cache   44.650 166.326     1.864H     0.41
    Mysterious Idol           16.908  14.510    13.053H     0.41
    Occupied CryoPod          15.057  29.536       373H     0.57
    Occupied Escape Pod       15.057  29.569       373H     0.41
    Personal Effects           4.419   9.087       373H     0.41
    Political Prisoner         3.157   7.015     1.864H     0.41
    Precious Gems             27.968 125.689     1.864H     0.41
    Rare Artwork               2.642   8.100     1.864H     0.41
    Salvageable Wreckage       4.746   7.654     3.729H     0.41
    Scientific Research          975   2.516     1.864H     0.41
    Scientific Samples         1.148   1.200     1.864H     0.41
    Small Survey Data Cache    5.481  10.655     1.864H     0.41
    Space Pioneer Relics       8.125   7.224    24.241H     0.41
    Tactical Data                657     954     1.864H     0.41
    Time Capsule               4.438   4.220     1.864H     0.41
    Unstable Data Core         2.577   2.878     1.864H     0.41
+SLAVERY
    Imperial Slaves           16.296  17.251       819H     0.41
+TECHNOLOGY
    Advanced Catalysers        2.946   3.460    15.632H     0.41
    H.E. Suits                 1.978     778 1.391.050H     0.41
    Resonating Separators      6.235   6.629     8.890H     0.41
+TEXTILES
    Conductive Fabrics                                          
    Military Grade Fabrics                                      
    Synthetic Fabrics                                           
+WASTE
    Biowaste                                                    
    Chemical Waste               575     517       504H     0.41
    Scrap                        477     185     4.437H     0.41
+WEAPONS
    Non-lethal Weapons         2.529   2.238    20.928H     0.41
    Reactive Armour            1.956   2.519       145H     0.41
If you use the order "sell" then you have to specify the commodity.
maybe like this...

Code:
Command line: -u "C:\trade\trade.py" sell --near="Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital" --ly=50.00 --pad=L --limit=42 -vvv -P "Basic Medicines"
Station                                  Cost     Demand DistLy Age/days      StnLs B/mkt Pad Plt
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ya'Nomamo/Ptack Landing                 5.035    154.499  41.37    23.29        798    No Lrg Yes
HIP 6011/Fedden Terminal                4.670 18.462.616  34.67   127.90      6.63K    No Lrg  No
HIP 6847/Keyes Escape                   4.616     50.800  49.88   143.31      3.39K    No Lrg Yes
Cemplangpa/Nicholson Orbital            4.598  3.322.567   0.00     0.85        136    No Lrg  No
Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital              4.598  3.322.567   0.00     1.31        205    No Lrg  No
Cemplangpa/Heck Refinery                4.598     43.100   0.00    15.63        41K   Yes Lrg Yes
Nyalayan/Arfstrom Legacy                2.577          0   8.40    11.73         56    No Lrg Yes
Autrimpe/Leberecht Tempel Vision        2.038     18.650  34.86     0.81        294    No Lrg  No
Hyperborea/Casa Lofthus                 2.038     13.154  45.86     0.50        718    No Lrg  No
HIP 7386/Albitzky Relay                 1.989        960   9.30     8.86        54K    No Lrg Yes
...
Order "sell" only worked for me the second time :S

Greetings Mathias
 
Hello Mark,

I use the order "market" , and the is this the output:

Code:
Command line: -u "C:\trade\trade.py" market --b -vvv "Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital"
    Item                      Buying     Avg     Demand Age/Days
----------------------------------------------------------------
+CHEMICALS
    Explosives                                                  
    Hydrogen Fuel                                               
    Hydrogen Peroxide            659   1.105     8.441H     0.41
    Liquid Oxygen                598     438         0?     0.41
    Mineral Oil                  418     472    28.960H     0.41
    Surface Stabilisers                                         
    Water                        601     397       904H     0.41
+CONSUMER ITEMS
    Clothing                     371     539     2.707H     0.41
    Consumer Technology        6.876   7.346       367H     0.41
    Domestic Appliances          813     781       926H     0.41
+FOODS
    Animal Meat                1.689   1.775    69.014M     5.49
    Coffee                     1.843   1.729    21.433M     5.49
    Fish                         891     815   246.541M     5.49
    Food Cartridges              614     337    16.571H     5.49
    Fruit and Vegetables         783     682    77.868M     5.49
    Grain                        646     569   505.549M     5.49
    Synthetic Meat               725     602    52.130H     5.49
    Tea                        2.051   1.936    79.972M     5.49
+INDUSTRIAL MATERIALS
    Insulating Membrane                                         
    Polymers                                                    
    Semiconductors                                              
    Superconductors                                             
+LEGAL DRUGS
    Beer                         346     556     3.952H     0.41
    Bootleg Liquor               697     598     6.012H     0.41
    Liquor                     1.288     993    30.744H     0.41
    Tobacco                    5.326   5.446       317H     0.41
    Wine                         664     536     2.658H     0.41
+MACHINERY
    Microbial Furnaces           588     584     9.158H     0.41
    Power Generators             889     757     3.132H     0.41
    Water Purifiers            1.833     503   126.150H     0.41
+MEDICINES
    Advanced Medicines         3.226   1.845 9.458.406H     0.41
    Basic Medicines            4.598     838 3.322.567H     0.41
    Performance Enhancers      6.876   7.407       132H     0.41
    Progenitor Cells           6.876   7.301       184H     0.41
+METALS
    Aluminium                                                   
    Beryllium                                                   
    Cobalt                                                      
    Copper                                                      
    Gallium                                                     
    Gold                                                        
    Indium                                                      
    Lithium                                                     
    Palladium                                                   
    Silver                                                      
    Tantalum                                                    
    Titanium                                                    
    Uranium                                                     
+MINERALS
    Bauxite                      469     276    43.422H     0.41
    Bertrandite                2.577   2.611    17.289H     0.41
    Coltan                     1.333   1.566    27.397H     0.41
    Cryolite                   2.233   2.771    19.097H     0.41
    Gallite                    1.935   2.036    21.210H     0.41
    Goslarite                    616   1.335    20.676H     0.41
    Indite                     2.233   2.344    19.165H     0.41
    Lepidolite                   659     768    28.060H     0.41
    Lithium Hydroxide          5.044   5.572     1.551H     0.41
    Low Temperature Diamonds  97.629  96.080        30H     0.41
    Methane Clathrate            595     833    13.422H     0.41
    Painite                   33.320  70.913       373H     0.41
    Pyrophyllite               1.441   2.029    17.727H     0.41
    Rutile                       508     466    14.767H     0.41
    Uraninite                    686   1.056    19.654H     0.41
+SALVAGE
    Ancient Casket             8.043   7.961     3.315H     0.41
    Ancient Key               13.240  13.160     3.315H     0.57
    Ancient Orb                9.094   9.010     3.315H     0.41
    Ancient Relic             13.240  13.141     3.315H     0.41
    Ancient Tablet             9.094   9.009     3.315H     0.41
    Ancient Totem             10.962  10.871     3.315H     0.41
    Ancient Urn                6.313   6.237     3.315H     0.41
    Antique Jewellery         31.964 143.673     1.864H     0.41
    Assault Plans                628     961     1.864H     0.41
    Black Box                 17.145  18.676       373H     0.41
    Commercial Samples           586     586     1.864H     0.41
    Damaged Escape Pod         6.463  12.676       373H     0.41
    Data Core                  3.151   3.126     5.594H     0.41
    Diplomatic Bag               875   1.010     1.864H     0.41
    Earth Relics               5.837  11.806     1.864H     0.41
    Encrypted Correspondence     610     921     1.864H     0.41
    Encrypted Data Storage     1.191   1.535     1.864H     0.41
    Fossil Remnants           10.634   9.283    27.971H     0.41
    Gene Bank                  6.620  11.182     1.864H     0.41
    Geological Samples           628     758     1.864H     0.41
    Hostage                   24.981  37.219       373H     0.41
    Large Survey Data Cache   44.650 166.326     1.864H     0.41
    Mysterious Idol           16.908  14.510    13.053H     0.41
    Occupied CryoPod          15.057  29.536       373H     0.57
    Occupied Escape Pod       15.057  29.569       373H     0.41
    Personal Effects           4.419   9.087       373H     0.41
    Political Prisoner         3.157   7.015     1.864H     0.41
    Precious Gems             27.968 125.689     1.864H     0.41
    Rare Artwork               2.642   8.100     1.864H     0.41
    Salvageable Wreckage       4.746   7.654     3.729H     0.41
    Scientific Research          975   2.516     1.864H     0.41
    Scientific Samples         1.148   1.200     1.864H     0.41
    Small Survey Data Cache    5.481  10.655     1.864H     0.41
    Space Pioneer Relics       8.125   7.224    24.241H     0.41
    Tactical Data                657     954     1.864H     0.41
    Time Capsule               4.438   4.220     1.864H     0.41
    Unstable Data Core         2.577   2.878     1.864H     0.41
+SLAVERY
    Imperial Slaves           16.296  17.251       819H     0.41
+TECHNOLOGY
    Advanced Catalysers        2.946   3.460    15.632H     0.41
    H.E. Suits                 1.978     778 1.391.050H     0.41
    Resonating Separators      6.235   6.629     8.890H     0.41
+TEXTILES
    Conductive Fabrics                                          
    Military Grade Fabrics                                      
    Synthetic Fabrics                                           
+WASTE
    Biowaste                                                    
    Chemical Waste               575     517       504H     0.41
    Scrap                        477     185     4.437H     0.41
+WEAPONS
    Non-lethal Weapons         2.529   2.238    20.928H     0.41
    Reactive Armour            1.956   2.519       145H     0.41
If you use the order "sell" then you have to specify the commodity.
maybe like this...

Code:
Command line: -u "C:\trade\trade.py" sell --near="Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital" --ly=50.00 --pad=L --limit=42 -vvv -P "Basic Medicines"
Station                                  Cost     Demand DistLy Age/days      StnLs B/mkt Pad Plt
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ya'Nomamo/Ptack Landing                 5.035    154.499  41.37    23.29        798    No Lrg Yes
HIP 6011/Fedden Terminal                4.670 18.462.616  34.67   127.90      6.63K    No Lrg  No
HIP 6847/Keyes Escape                   4.616     50.800  49.88   143.31      3.39K    No Lrg Yes
Cemplangpa/Nicholson Orbital            4.598  3.322.567   0.00     0.85        136    No Lrg  No
Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital              4.598  3.322.567   0.00     1.31        205    No Lrg  No
Cemplangpa/Heck Refinery                4.598     43.100   0.00    15.63        41K   Yes Lrg Yes
Nyalayan/Arfstrom Legacy                2.577          0   8.40    11.73         56    No Lrg Yes
Autrimpe/Leberecht Tempel Vision        2.038     18.650  34.86     0.81        294    No Lrg  No
Hyperborea/Casa Lofthus                 2.038     13.154  45.86     0.50        718    No Lrg  No
HIP 7386/Albitzky Relay                 1.989        960   9.30     8.86        54K    No Lrg Yes
...
Order "sell" only worked for me the second time :S

Greetings Mathias
Hi Mathias, I get that as well with the Buy and Sell queries, but I am referring to the MARKET query. The buy and sell commands require a commodity and a source station and will show the nearby stations that buy or sell that commodity.

The Market command shows all the commodities to buy or sell at the source station.

trade.py market --buy -vv Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital -> does work as expected
trade.py market --sell -vv Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital -> does not work as expected
trade.py market -vv Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital -> does not work as expected

Thanks.
 
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Glad to see you using EDMC for this purpose. Not many people use that functionality (of EDMC or TD) so it's nice to have confirmation it's useful.

EDMC is our suggested tool for creating local .prices files (per wiki) and the only one we would support, as it's also well supported by our friends on the EDMC team.

Yes, I enjoy using EDMC and it works well. So you always have the current prices of the visited stations in the database.
 
Hi Mathias, I get that as well with the Buy and Sell queries, but I am referring to the MARKET query. The buy and sell commands require a commodity and a source station and will show the nearby stations that buy or sell that commodity.

The Market command shows all the commodities to buy or sell at the source station.

trade.py market --buy -vv Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital -> does work as expected
trade.py market --sell -vv Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital -> does not work as expected
trade.py market -vv Cemplangpa/Gorgani Orbital -> does not work as expected

Thanks.
OK, I understand. I tried too. The same result as yours. STOP only --sell ( -S ) does not work !
... market --buying ( -B ) OK
... market (alone) not OK
... market --selling ( -S ) not OK, Commodidies without prices, all columns are empty

Sorry, it is still different
... market (alone) not OK, columns Selling, Avg., Supply are empty
 
Last edited:
OK, I understand. I tried too. The same result as yours. STOP only --sell ( -S ) does not work !
... market --buying ( -B ) OK
... market (alone) not OK
... market --selling ( -S ) not OK, Commodidies without prices, all columns are empty

Sorry, it is still different
... market (alone) not OK, columns Selling, Avg., Supply are empty
Yes, that is what I am saying. The selling prices are missing, only the buying prices are displayed.

Okay, so I am not doing anything wrong. I'll raise an issues on GitHub for eyeonus to look at unless there is a prior reason why the selling prices are missing.

[Edit] Issue raised on GitHub
 
Last edited:
Ähhhhmmm sorry, I already have another problem :x
I wanted to import from EDMC again a price-file and got the following error ...
Code:
C:\trade>trade.py import "\Bielonti.Ahmed Dock.2018-09-04T22.40.20.prices"
C:\trade\trade.py: \Bielonti.Ahmed Dock.2018-09-04T22.40.20.prices:87 ERROR Unrecognized item name: "ANCIENTKEY"
I looked at the price-file and the item.csv and couldn't find a difference. :S
Then I looked at the market with TDHelper and I found a difference!
Here "ANCIENT KEY" is written apart. In the CLI and in the item.csv "ANCIENTKEY" is written together.
OK, I "corrected" the price-file (from ANCIENTKEY to ANCIENT KEY), then new import ...
Code:
C:\trade>trade.py import "\Bielonti.Ahmed Dock.2018-09-04T22.40.20.prices"
C:\trade\trade.py: \Bielonti.Ahmed Dock.2018-09-04T22.40.20.prices:116 ERROR Unrecognized item name: "WRECKAGE COMPONENTS"
"WRECKAGE COMPONENTS" is in the price-file but not in item.csv :S
I have also tried
Code:
C:\trade>trade.py import -P eddblink -O item,force
No change, same ERROR.

Greetings Mathias
 
Last edited:
Code:
C:\trade>trade.py import "\Bielonti.Ahmed Dock.2018-09-04T22.40.20.prices"
C:\trade\trade.py: \Bielonti.Ahmed Dock.2018-09-04T22.40.20.prices:116 ERROR Unrecognized item name: "WRECKAGE COMPONENTS"
"WRECKAGE COMPONENTS" is in the price-file but not in item.csv :S
I have also tried
Code:
C:\trade>trade.py import -P eddblink -O item,force
No change, same ERROR.

Greetings Mathias
Update TD and run the item update again.

Yes, that is what I am saying. The selling prices are missing, only the buying prices are displayed.

Okay, so I am not doing anything wrong. I'll raise an issues on GitHub for eyeonus to look at unless there is a prior reason why the selling prices are missing.

[Edit] Issue raised on GitHub

I'll look into it tomorrow / when I have time.
 
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I’ve found a station in the database that doesn’t seem to exist in Elite. Can someone remind me how to delete this station in TD? It’s been a really long time since I’ve done that, I can’t remember how to!
 
I’ve found a station in the database that doesn’t seem to exist in Elite. Can someone remind me how to delete this station in TD? It’s been a really long time since I’ve done that, I can’t remember how to!
Before you delete it, make sure it isn't a megaship. Those move around, so while it may not be in the system the DB says it's in, that might be because it jumped to another system.
 
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