Tenuous Atmospheres: How Will They Work...?

Y'all are weird :LOL:
Hah! Guilty!

But I should say, there's a sliding scale of satisfaction...

10 -- amazing value, high utility, deal of the century, will definitely buy
9
8
7
6 -- might buy, but will complain about it
5 -- probably won't buy
4
3
2
1 -- too expensive, no interest in it, will never buy

Just the basic atmospheres puts Odyssey at about a 5 going on a 6, for me. 😉
 
may be for you.
there are people paying hundred of dollars for a jpeg.
Wasn't my quote, "A cosmetic atmosphere - with no impact on flightmodel or gameplay - is NOT worth $30", it was Drew's
 
On the subject of how much of an impact a "simple" blue sky (and corresponding change in ambient lighting) will have, I was curious so I did a quick photoshop.

I took the following image of the Black Hide engineer base in Wyrd ..



.. and simply cropped out the land, increased its gamma a tad and pasted it onto a nice blue sky background.



Personally I'd say the difference is profound and I can't bloomin' wait to be able to fly (and drive) around in environments like that.
 
On the subject of how much of an impact a "simple" blue sky (and corresponding change in ambient lighting) will have, I was curious so I did a quick photoshop.

I took the following image of the Black Hide engineer base in Wyrd ..



.. and simply cropped out the land, increased its gamma a tad and pasted it onto a nice blue sky background.



Personally I'd say the difference is profound and I can't bloomin' wait to be able to fly (and drive) around in environments like that.
I'd dare say, the difference is night and day...
 
I do, however the background scenery and environment in the trailers featuring other content have been pretty spot on to what we get in game. Unless I am missing something here...
It entirely possible that the area shown in the trailer is handcrafted, rather than procgen. I predict that the FPS areas are designed and placed (like the big Guardian thing with the cave) and that planets in general are much less 'interesting' topographically.
 
It entirely possible that the area shown in the trailer is handcrafted, rather than procgen. I predict that the FPS areas are designed and placed (like the big Guardian thing with the cave) and that planets in general are much less 'interesting' topographically.
I won't completely discount it, but I doubt it.

In your point's favour, what you're saying is actually true of Engineer bases (lots of handcrafted cliffs and unique rock formations at some of these) as well as Thargoid and Guardian sites.

However, the Engineer bases are very limited in number. The alien sites are much more widespread, but are, in fact, copy-pastes of a very small number of templates overlaid onto procedural terrain.

So if we imagine the new surface features are mostly handcrafted and limited to the areas around surface installations, bases, etc.... you're looking at handcrafting hundreds or thousands of sites, at minimum, for the new sites to be remotely comparable to even the current (very basic and underutilised) implementation of surface installations. Or we're looking at copy-paste terrain, which they've never done (only for artificial structures) and doesn't really make sense in the context of the game world or the game's concept.

Or there's just a few handfuls of surface sites built with Odyssey in mind, which would not only be terribly disappointing, but also still a large amount of work to produce.

But Elite has always championed procedural generation, for better and for worse.

For a team like FDev's, experienced in proc gen, the time and effort costs of improving the surface creation algorithms is likely in the same ballpark as manually building a whole poop ton of bespoke combat environments and plopping them down atop the boring old planet tech, with the added benefit of being scalable across the whole galaxy and actually dovetailing with their whole aim of "exploring beautiful new vistas" etc.

Plus, we know similar tech has been achieved by other teams (Star Citizen has procedural surfaces roughly comparable to what we see in the Odyssey trailer, for example), so we know doing this procedurally is possible, and in FDev's wheelhouse.

Barring some catastrophic engine limitation putting a roadblock in the way (and if that's the case, why the near-exclusive focus on planets?), then it's a no-brainer.

I would not be surprised if they picked a particularly pretty procedural planet for the teaser, nor would I choke on my tea if someone told me they hand-placed a few rocks to perfect the specific shots, but I personally don't see the average planet being drastically below what they've showed us so far, or these detail levels being limited to certain areas.

Yeah, we've seen features released half-baked before, but the implementation you're suggesting just doesn't seem like FDev's style to me.

If FDev is going to let us down in this regard, it's less likely to be a case of most planets failing to look this good, and more likely to be a case of all planets looking almost exactly like this. ;)
 
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I won't completely discount it, but I doubt it.

In your point's favour, what you're saying is actually true of Engineer bases (lots of handcrafted cliffs and unique rock formations at some of these) as well as Thargoid and Guardian sites.

However, the Engineer bases are very limited in number. The alien sites are much more widespread, but are, in fact, copy-pastes of a very small number of templates overlaid onto procedural terrain.

So if we imagine the new surface features are mostly handcrafted and limited to the areas around surface installations, bases, etc.... you're looking at handcrafting hundreds or thousands of sites, at minimum, for the new sites to be remotely comparable to even the current (very basic and underutilised) implementation of surface installations. Or we're looking at copy-paste terrain, which they've never done (only for artificial structures) and doesn't really make sense in the context of the game world or the game's concept.

Or there's just a few handfuls of surface sites built with Odyssey in mind, which would not only be terribly disappointing, but also still a large amount of work to produce.

But Elite has always championed procedural generation, for better and for worse.

For a team like FDev's, experienced in proc gen, the time and effort costs of improving the surface creation algorithms is likely in the same ballpark as manually building a whole poop ton of bespoke combat environments and plopping them down atop the boring old planet tech, with the added benefit of being scalable across the whole galaxy and actually dovetailing with their whole aim of "exploring beautiful new vistas" etc.

Plus, we know similar tech has been achieved by other teams (Star Citizen has procedural surfaces roughly comparable to what we see in the Odyssey trailer, for example), so we know doing this procedurally is possible, and in FDev's wheelhouse.

Barring some catastrophic engine limitation putting a roadblock in the way (and if that's the case, why the near-exclusive focus on planets?), then it's a no-brainer.

I would not be surprised if they picked a particularly pretty procedural planet for the teaser, nor would I choke on my tea if someone told me they hand-placed a few rocks to perfect the specific shots, but I personally don't see the average planet being drastically below what they've showed us so far, or these detail levels being limited to certain areas.

Yeah, we've seen features released half-baked before, but the implementation you're suggesting just doesn't seem like FDev's style to me.

If FDev is going to let us down in this regard, it's less likely to be a case of most planets failing to look this good, and more likely to be a case of all planets looking almost exactly like this. ;)
As I said waaay back on page 1 of this thread, I'm keeping my expectations very low, so as not to be ultimately disappointed. I'd be very happy to be wrong.
 
TL:DR


They mean you only get to land on planets with atmospheres of 0.00 to 0.01 or less, knowing FDev's half- philosophy
 
TL:DR


They mean you only get to land on planets with atmospheres of 0.00 to 0.01 or less, knowing FDev's half- philosophy

Well we’ll see. It seems a lot of the planets in the scientifically 'tenuous' / exospheric range are already unlocked.

If the game’s internal 'thin' atmosphere category does turn out to be the tier that’s being unlocked, then they go up as high as thousands of atmospheres in some cases, going by Straha’s digging so far.

Mainly boring nitrogen atmospheres, but hey, maybe the ammonia ones will hide Thargoids ;)
 
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On the subject of how much of an impact a "simple" blue sky (and corresponding change in ambient lighting) will have, I was curious so I did a quick photoshop.

I took the following image of the Black Hide engineer base in Wyrd ..



.. and simply cropped out the land, increased its gamma a tad and pasted it onto a nice blue sky background.



Personally I'd say the difference is profound and I can't bloomin' wait to be able to fly (and drive) around in environments like that.
Reverse engineering you'll be banned...lol
 
WOW! How did I miss this (just saw it featured by Obsidian Ant). That's flippin' awesome! Wish I'd seen this sooner - makes my naff "blue skies over Black Hide" photoshop somewhat redundant. 😂
Photoshop let you add a nice gradient, which I'd love to be able to do via a shader, but it's not trivial. There is no atmosphere shader, just the skybox shader which is designed for space, so there's no easy way to orient a gradient with the horizon / sun (this would need to be done in the game engine). I could fake it for a still shot, but it would "fall apart" as soon as I start flying around.

But then again, I might be able to come up with something kinda clever - I haven't given up hope just yet! In the meantime, your effort was not in vain :D
 
There's an impressive number of apparently new surface features shown in the trailer.

Can anyone see anything else?

The subtle overhangs are the most interesting thing to me, given the limitations of the heightmap surface generation in Elite. Are they just a smoke-and-mirrors trick using the lighting engine and shadows? Are they injecting meshes along the edge of the cliffs to produce the overhangs?


View attachment 179200




There's a definite overhang in this next one:

View attachment 179201

Whether they're just standing on a rock model or it's actually part of the landscape remains to be seen.
Ice planet enhancements are years over due, so I'm assuming we'll be getting those too as part of the "tenuous" surface improvements...
 
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